[H390-MVS] 3215 console missing

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

I have been following the steps of Jay Moseley's
instructions and I am up to here:

http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/icustom.htm

section "IPL the MVS system" which says:

"Note: You must use a tn3270 client for the generated MVS 3.8j console and not a telnet client as we have been using for the starter system console."


My experimentation is that that is correct, that
I can't use a 3215 like I could with the starter
system.

I suspect that the reason for that is the step here:

http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/iSYSGEN.htm

that says "Stage 1 SYSGEN01
The Stage 1 jobstream - SYSGEN01 (contained in file sysgen01.jcl in the jcl directory) - contains all of the specifications for the hardware configuration of the new MVS 3.8j system to be built."


I have looked at that sysgen01.jcl (excerpt below)
and it seems that there are indeed no 3215 consoles
defined. The TK3 system allows both 3215 and
3270 as far as I know, so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here.

Can someone confirm this and tell me what I need
to do to get a 3215 defined at this stage so that I
never need to use a 3270 console?

Thanks. Paul.



* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00430003
* SYSTEM CONSOLES * 00440003
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00450003
* 00460003
CONSMST CONSOLE C00470003
MCONS=010, C00480003
ALTCONS=009, C00490003
AREA=04, C00500003
PFK=12, C00510003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00520003
* 00530003
CONSALT CONSOLE C00540003
SECONS=009, C00550003
ALTCONS=010, C00560003
AREA=04, C00570003
PFK=12, C00580003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00590003
* 00600003
CONSHC CONSOLE C00610003
SECONS=O-015, C00620003
ALTCONS=009, C00630003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00640003
* 00650003
MSTCONS IODEVICE C00660003
UNIT=3277, C00670003
MODEL=2, C00680003
ADDRESS=010, C00690003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00700003
* 00710003
ALTCONS IODEVICE C00720003
UNIT=3277, C00730003
MODEL=2, C00740003
ADDRESS=009, C00750003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00760003
* 00770003
HCCONS IODEVICE C00780003
UNIT=1403, C00790003
MODEL=2, C00800003
ADDRESS=015 00810003
EJECT 00820003

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
Can someone confirm this and tell me what I need
to do to get a 3215 defined at this stage so that I
never need to use a 3270 console?

At the same time I would like to be able
to telnet to TSO. Currently it seems that
only 3270s are defined as terminals, based
on the Hercules config file:

# ----------------------------------------------- 3270's for TSO
0400.8 3270 tso

What do I need to define at this stage so that
I can later use telnet to log on to TSO?

Thanks. Paul.

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Juergen's tk4- release defines several TCP ports that can be used to access TSO in "line mode". When using a standard TELNET client you can connect to TSO but TSO recognizes the terminal as a "TTY" type of terminal in line mode, *not* as a 327x terminal. Hence you will receive error messages if you attempt to invoke a "full screen" TSO app. The QUEUE, RFE, and RPF commands all will return such messages and refuse to start. If using Juergen's tk4- distro there is nothing extra that you'd need to sysgen or configure to do this...

Max

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Hi Max.

I'm creating a new distro using the Jay Moseley
instructions.

Any idea what I need to do to get a line mode
TTY connected to TSO?

Thanks. Paul.




---In H390-***@yahoogroups.com, <***@...> wrote :

Juergen's tk4- release defines several TCP ports that can be used to access TSO in "line mode". When using a standard TELNET client you can connect to TSO but TSO recognizes the terminal as a "TTY" type of terminal in line mode, *not* as a 327x terminal. Hence you will receive error messages if you attempt to invoke a "full screen" TSO app. The QUEUE, RFE, and RPF commands all will return such messages and refuse to start. If using Juergen's tk4- distro there is nothing extra that you'd need to sysgen or configure to do this...

Max

['Dave Wade' [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

-----Original Message-----
Sent: 20 February 2018 17:34
Subject: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing
Hi Max.
I'm creating a new distro using the Jay Moseley instructions.
Any idea what I need to do to get a line mode TTY connected to TSO?
Thanks. Paul.

You need to use TCAM but it needs to be via telnet so that’s no use for your scripts. Or is it? Could you run a telnet session in a script...

http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/README.txt

Note This support is now in Hercules but as its not much used it may be flaky. I think you need to use TCAM because VTAM does not provide access to line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands, but I have no idea of the details. I know VTAM on VM/SP5 and later does allow line mode terminals

https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSB27U_6.4.0/com.ibm.zvm.v640.hcpb1/c4snalu.htm

because we hi-jacked SNA *CCS services to pipe line mode terminals from X25 PADs into VM on the Network/VM project..
..

Dave

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
You need to use TCAM but it needs to be via
telnet so that’s no use for your scripts. Or is it?
Could you run a telnet session in a script...

I wanted telnet so that Unix C programmers
don't need to install a 3270 emulator if they
wish to test bwbasic etc interactively.

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/README.txt

Yikes!

Well good news is that 2703 is mentioned in
Hercules 3.07, so maybe that bit is already done.

Also I saw this in the Moseley sysgen:

***@6 IODEVICE C
UNIT=BSC1, C
ADAPTER=BSCA, C
TCU=2703, C
ADDRESS=602

Does that mean that at address 602 I have the
required definition?

Thanks. Paul.

['Dave Wade' [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

-----Original Message-----
Sent: 20 February 2018 22:24
Subject: RE: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
You need to use TCAM but it needs to be via telnet so that’s no use
for your scripts. Or is it?
Could you run a telnet session in a script...

I wanted telnet so that Unix C programmers don't need to install a 3270
emulator if they wish to test bwbasic etc interactively.

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/README.txt

Yikes!
Well good news is that 2703 is mentioned in Hercules 3.07, so maybe that bit
is already done.
UNIT=BSC1, C
ADAPTER=BSCA, C
TCU=2703, C
ADDRESS=602
Does that mean that at address 602 I have the required definition?

Does it say tty?

Thanks. Paul.
------------------------------------
------------------------------------
------------------------------------
Yahoo Groups Links

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

"Does that mean that at address 602 I have the required definition?"

No, that merely means that at 602 you have a controller.

You must still define that to TCAM/VTAM.

Joe

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]

-----Original Message-----
Sent: 20 February 2018 22:24
Subject: RE: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
You need to use TCAM but it needs to be via telnet so that’s no use
for your scripts. Or is it?
Could you run a telnet session in a script...

I wanted telnet so that Unix C programmers don't need to install a 3270
emulator if they wish to test bwbasic etc interactively.

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/README.txt

Yikes!
Well good news is that 2703 is mentioned in Hercules 3.07, so maybe that

bit

is already done.
UNIT=BSC1, C
ADAPTER=BSCA, C
TCU=2703, C
ADDRESS=602
Does that mean that at address 602 I have the required definition?

Does it say tty?

Thanks. Paul.
------------------------------------
------------------------------------
------------------------------------
Yahoo Groups Links

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
VTAM does not provide access to line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands,

That's not correct, TSO/VTAM in MVS 3.8 ***does*** provide line mode terminal support.

It is also possible to access MVS 3.8 TSO in line mode via TCAM.

There are many differences between VTAM and TCAM when using TSO line mode. For example in TCAM the ASCII and EBCDIC translations are performed by TCAM and the devices are defined to TCAM as "TTY33/35" (numbers refer to the Teletype Co. model #'s); whereas in VTAM the devices are supported using the TSO/VTAM VTIOC "device handler" for the IBM 3767 device type and ASCII/EBCDIC mapping is performed in my Hercules 3705 device driver (comm3705.c), which was integrated into Hercules long ago.

For any questions I recommend simply referring to Juergen's most excellent tk4- distro - the Hercules configuration files, as well as all host configurations and SYSGEN work has already been done.

I am the author of the original lightlink.com documentation. That is still useful but should now be viewed as "historical". There have been many developments since then that are not documented there. The latest releases of Hercules and/or tk4- should now be considered "authoritative" with respect to 2703 and 3705 support.

Regards

Max

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Hi Dave


The TK4- User's Manual has a chapter named "Alternative Methods to Access TSO" describing all the various ways to log on using 3270 or line mode terminals from the end user point of view. Of course this doesn't replace Max' technical documentation (which btw ist archived on the system under hlq TK4-.MAX), but it's just what most users are interested in: How do I connect and start using the desired terminal.



Cheers
JÃŒrgen


---In H390-***@yahoogroups.com, <***@...> wrote :


Max,

Thanks for popping in. After more reading I found the 3767 info on the SNA FEP support page. I find your documentation invaluable as whilst many of the bugs are fixed in current versions of Hercules, the accompanying documentation is “sparse” and whilst new MVS distros are great for new starters I am sure there are folks out there whose systems have diverged a lot from the originals so moving might not be easy..

Dave



From: H390-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 21 February 2018 01:11
To: H390-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
VTAM does not provide access to line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands,

That's not correct, TSO/VTAM in MVS 3.8 ***does*** provide line mode terminal support.

It is also possible to access MVS 3.8 TSO in line mode via TCAM.

There are many differences between VTAM and TCAM when using TSO line mode. For example in TCAM the ASCII and EBCDIC translations are performed by TCAM and the devices are defined to TCAM as "TTY33/35" (numbers refer to the Teletype Co. model #'s); whereas in VTAM the devices are supported using the TSO/VTAM VTIOC "device handler" for the IBM 3767 device type and ASCII/EBCDIC mapping is performed in my Hercules 3705 device driver (comm3705.c), which was integrated into Hercules long ago.

For any questions I recommend simply referring to Juergen's most excellent tk4- distro - the Hercules configuration files, as well as all host configurations and SYSGEN work has already been done.

I am the author of the original lightlink.com documentation. That is still useful but should now be viewed as "historical". There have been many developments since then that are not documented there. The latest releases of Hercules and/or tk4- should now be considered "authoritative" with respect to 2703 and 3705 support.

Regards

Max

['Dave Wade' [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

JÃŒrgen

Thanks for that, bookmarked for future reference. I must admit I can’t remember the last time I ran MVS. Even to re-build the VM Assembler I just mounted the source packs on VM. However, this support is useful for the APL (I think) etc.

Dave



From: H390-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 21 February 2018 10:21
To: H390-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing








Hi Dave



The TK4- User's Manual has a chapter named "Alternative Methods to Access TSO" describing all the various ways to log on using 3270 or line mode terminals from the end user point of view. Of course this doesn't replace Max' technical documentation (which btw ist archived on the system under hlq TK4-..MAX), but it's just what most users are interested in: How do I connect and start using the desired terminal.



Cheers

JÃŒrgen



---In H390-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com> , <***@... <mailto:***@...> > wrote :

Max,



Thanks for popping in. After more reading I found the 3767 info on the SNA FEP support page. I find your documentation invaluable as whilst many of the bugs are fixed in current versions of Hercules, the accompanying documentation is “sparse” and whilst new MVS distros are great for new starters I am sure there are folks out there whose systems have diverged a lot from the originals so moving might not be easy..



Dave







From: H390-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 21 February 2018 01:11
To: H390-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
VTAM does not provide access to line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands,

That's not correct, TSO/VTAM in MVS 3.8 ***does*** provide line mode terminal support.

It is also possible to access MVS 3.8 TSO in line mode via TCAM.

There are many differences between VTAM and TCAM when using TSO line mode. For example in TCAM the ASCII and EBCDIC translations are performed by TCAM and the devices are defined to TCAM as "TTY33/35" (numbers refer to the Teletype Co. model #'s); whereas in VTAM the devices are supported using the TSO/VTAM VTIOC "device handler" for the IBM 3767 device type and ASCII/EBCDIC mapping is performed in my Hercules 3705 device driver (comm3705.c), which was integrated into Hercules long ago.

For any questions I recommend simply referring to Juergen's most excellent tk4- distro - the Hercules configuration files, as well as all host configurations and SYSGEN work has already been done.

I am the author of the original lightlink.com documentation. That is still useful but should now be viewed as "historical". There have been many developments since then that are not documented there. The latest releases of Hercules and/or tk4- should now be considered "authoritative" with respect to 2703 and 3705 support.

Regards

Max

[Gerhard Postpischil [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
Note This support is now in Hercules but as its not much used it may be flaky. I think you need to use TCAM because VTAM does not provide access to line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands, but I have no idea of the details. I know VTAM on VM/SP5 and later does allow line mode terminals

Under tk4-, TCAM supports 2741 (I think), and TTY (TWX). They seem to
work under TSO, but with EXCP they require special handling. Our FEPs
were configured to generate an interrupt on CR and ATTN, but last time I
tried that, Max didn't provide that, and I had to scrape the input buffer.

VTAM supports line mode terminals, but expects the FEP to make them look
like SNA NTO devices. Too much work to put in Hercules?

Gerhard Postpischil
Bradford, VT

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Hi Max


good to read from you again and thanks for the plug concerning TK4-. Hope you are well!


Cheers
JÃŒrgen


P.S. for Paul's reference: Max is the author of the "line mode" and SNA 3270 terminal support that I'm providing with TK4-, where line mode are the async 2703 lines attaching TTYs and 2741s, and the 3705 and 3791 SNA controllers, attaching 3767s. All three line mode terminal types use telnet as a terminal emulation, which isn't to be confused with MVS "speaking" telnet miraculously. Neither MVS nor TSO know a thing about telnet (or tn3270 on the 3270 side of things); the devices are controlled by TCAM (those attached through async lines) and VTAM (those attached through lines controlled by the SNA controllers).


And, Paul, Max knows _everything_ about async and SNA communications... so, be careful what you ask, as you will get realistic answers, which probably will not match your fantasies.


---In H390-***@yahoogroups.com, <***@...> wrote :

Juergen's tk4- release defines several TCP ports that can be used to access TSO in "line mode". When using a standard TELNET client you can connect to TSO but TSO recognizes the terminal as a "TTY" type of terminal in line mode, *not* as a 327x terminal. Hence you will receive error messages if you attempt to invoke a "full screen" TSO app. The QUEUE, RFE, and RPF commands all will return such messages and refuse to start. If using Juergen's tk4- distro there is nothing extra that you'd need to sysgen or configure to do this...

Max

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

"so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here."

Because a 3277 is a much cleaner installation.

Joe

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
I have been following the steps of Jay Moseley's
http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/icustom.htm
"Note: You must use a tn3270 client for the generated MVS 3.8j console and
not a telnet client as we have been using for the starter system console."
My experimentation is that that is correct, that
I can't use a 3215 like I could with the starter
system.
http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/iSYSGEN.htm
that says "Stage 1 SYSGEN01
The Stage 1 jobstream - SYSGEN01 (contained in file sysgen01.jcl in the
jcl directory) - contains all of the specifications for the hardware
configuration of the new MVS 3.8j system to be built."
I have looked at that sysgen01.jcl (excerpt below)
and it seems that there are indeed no 3215 consoles
defined. The TK3 system allows both 3215 and
3270 as far as I know, so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here.
Can someone confirm this and tell me what I need
to do to get a 3215 defined at this stage so that I
never need to use a 3270 console?
Thanks. Paul.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00430003
* SYSTEM CONSOLES * 00440003
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00450003
* 00460003
CONSMST CONSOLE C00470003
MCONS=010, C00480003
ALTCONS=009, C00490003
AREA=04, C00500003
PFK=12, C00510003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00520003
* 00530003
CONSALT CONSOLE C00540003
SECONS=009, C00550003
ALTCONS=010, C00560003
AREA=04, C00570003
PFK=12, C00580003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00590003
* 00600003
CONSHC CONSOLE C00610003
SECONS=O-015, C00620003
ALTCONS=009, C00630003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00640003
* 00650003
MSTCONS IODEVICE C00660003
UNIT=3277, C00670003
MODEL=2, C00680003
ADDRESS=010, C00690003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00700003
* 00710003
ALTCONS IODEVICE C00720003
UNIT=3277, C00730003
MODEL=2, C00740003
ADDRESS=009, C00750003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00760003
* 00770003
HCCONS IODEVICE C00780003
UNIT=1403, C00790003
MODEL=2, C00800003
ADDRESS=015 00810003
EJECT 00820003

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by Joe Monk ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here.

Because a 3277 is a much cleaner installation.

I see. Ok, well I need an unclean installation
because what I am actually doing is using the
Hercules integrated console to automate
everything.

What do I need to add to add line mode
terminals as both console and to log on to TSO?

Thanks. Paul.

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

- - - In H390-***@yahoogroups.com, <***@...> wrote :
- - - beginning snipped - - -

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
I have looked at that sysgen01.jcl (excerpt below)
and it seems that there are indeed no 3215 consoles
defined. The TK3 system allows both 3215 and
3270 as far as I know, so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here.

Back when the instructions were written,
Hercules did not have an integrated console.
Line-mode telnet would hang MVS constantly
with console buffers full.
Some people couldn't clear buffers without
a working console and without knowing the
cause of the issue.

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
Can someone confirm this and tell me what I need
to do to get a 3215 defined at this stage so that I
never need to use a 3270 console?
Thanks. Paul.

Change the IODEVICE and drop any CRT stuff
from it like MODEL= and FEATURE=

If you can't spell 3215, then refer to the TK3 or
other STAGE1

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

and of course, the 3215 is not a supported device type, at least in MVS 3.8 TSO.

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

In sysgen01.jcl:

find the following lines:

MSTCONS IODEVICE
C00660003
UNIT=3277,
C00670003
MODEL=2,
C00680003
ADDRESS=010,
C00690003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN)
00700003

And change to:

MSTCONS IODEVICE
C00660003
UNIT=3215,
C00670003
ADDRESS=010
C00690003


Then start the SYSGEN all over again (i.e. blow away your DASDs MVSRES,
PAGE00, SPOOL0)

Joe

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
I have been following the steps of Jay Moseley's
http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/icustom.htm
"Note: You must use a tn3270 client for the generated MVS 3.8j console and
not a telnet client as we have been using for the starter system console."
My experimentation is that that is correct, that
I can't use a 3215 like I could with the starter
system.
http://www.jaymoseley.com/hercules/installMVS/iSYSGEN.htm
that says "Stage 1 SYSGEN01
The Stage 1 jobstream - SYSGEN01 (contained in file sysgen01.jcl in the
jcl directory) - contains all of the specifications for the hardware
configuration of the new MVS 3.8j system to be built."
I have looked at that sysgen01.jcl (excerpt below)
and it seems that there are indeed no 3215 consoles
defined. The TK3 system allows both 3215 and
3270 as far as I know, so I don't know why 3215
is being left out as an option here.
Can someone confirm this and tell me what I need
to do to get a 3215 defined at this stage so that I
never need to use a 3270 console?
Thanks. Paul.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00430003
* SYSTEM CONSOLES * 00440003
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 00450003
* 00460003
CONSMST CONSOLE C00470003
MCONS=010, C00480003
ALTCONS=009, C00490003
AREA=04, C00500003
PFK=12, C00510003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00520003
* 00530003
CONSALT CONSOLE C00540003
SECONS=009, C00550003
ALTCONS=010, C00560003
AREA=04, C00570003
PFK=12, C00580003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00590003
* 00600003
CONSHC CONSOLE C00610003
SECONS=O-015, C00620003
ALTCONS=009, C00630003
ROUTCDE=ALL 00640003
* 00650003
MSTCONS IODEVICE C00660003
UNIT=3277, C00670003
MODEL=2, C00680003
ADDRESS=010, C00690003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00700003
* 00710003
ALTCONS IODEVICE C00720003
UNIT=3277, C00730003
MODEL=2, C00740003
ADDRESS=009, C00750003
FEATURE=(EBKY3277,DOCHAR,KB78KEY,AUDALRM,NUMLOCK,SELPEN) 00760003
* 00770003
HCCONS IODEVICE C00780003
UNIT=1403, C00790003
MODEL=2, C00800003
ADDRESS=015 00810003
EJECT 00820003

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Thankyou those who answered this question. I
have been successful with the below change
at getting the 3215 defined so that I can automate
the operation of MVS. That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?

Thanks. Paul.


C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>cvs diff
cvs diff: Diffing .
Index: sysgen01.jcl
===================================================================
RCS file: c:\cvsroot/mvsbuild/jcl/sysgen01.jcl,v
retrieving revision 1.3
diff -r1.3 sysgen01.jcl
60a61,70

CONSOLE C
SECONS=011, C
ALTCONS=012, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*
CONSOLE C
SECONS=012, C
ALTCONS=011, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*

71a82,89

CON011 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=011
*
CON012 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=012
*

C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

"That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?"

Already told you its in VTAM definitions.

Joe

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
Thankyou those who answered this question. I
have been successful with the below change
at getting the 3215 defined so that I can automate
the operation of MVS. That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?
Thanks. Paul.
C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>cvs diff
cvs diff: Diffing .
Index: sysgen01.jcl
===================================================================
RCS file: c:\cvsroot/mvsbuild/jcl/sysgen01.jcl,v
retrieving revision 1.3
diff -r1.3 sysgen01.jcl
60a61,70

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CONSOLE C
SECONS=011, C
ALTCONS=012, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*
CONSOLE C
SECONS=012, C
ALTCONS=011, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*

71a82,89

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CON011 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=011
*
CON012 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=012
*

C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>

['Dave Wade' [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Joe,



Please excuse my ramblings.



Does the VTAM in 3.8j support line mode terminals in a way that TSO understands? If so you do the lightlink docs suggest using TCAM?



http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/





Dave



From: H390-***@yahoogroups.com [mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 20 February 2018 21:39
To: H390-***@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing








"That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?"



Already told you its in VTAM definitions.



Joe



On Tue, Feb 20, 2018 at 2:58 PM, ***@yahoo.com.au <mailto:***@yahoo.com.au> [H390-MVS] <H390-***@yahoogroups.com <mailto:H390-***@yahoogroups.com> > wrote:



Thankyou those who answered this question. I
have been successful with the below change
at getting the 3215 defined so that I can automate
the operation of MVS. That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?

Thanks. Paul.

C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>cvs diff
cvs diff: Diffing .
Index: sysgen01.jcl
===================================================================
RCS file: c:\cvsroot/mvsbuild/jcl/sysgen01.jcl,v
retrieving revision 1.3
diff -r1.3 sysgen01.jcl
60a61,70

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CONSOLE C
SECONS=011, C
ALTCONS=012, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*
CONSOLE C
SECONS=012, C
ALTCONS=011, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*

71a82,89

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CON011 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=011
*
CON012 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=012
*

C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Also, comm3705.c indicates that it provides LU1 support. This would
indicate that the VTAM in MVS3.8J does line mode terminals.

Joe

Dave,
A 3705 can be run in 2703 emulation mode. But you need a "start/stop"
group I believe instead of a "BSC" group. The "start/stop" group is what
provides TTY support.
Joe

Post by 'Dave Wade' ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
Joe,
Please excuse my ramblings.
Does the VTAM in 3.8j support line mode terminals in a way that TSO
understands? If so you do the lightlink docs suggest using TCAM?
http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/
Dave
*Sent:* 20 February 2018 21:39
*Subject:* Re: [H390-MVS] Re: 3215 console missing
"That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?"
Already told you its in VTAM definitions.
Joe
Thankyou those who answered this question. I
have been successful with the below change
at getting the 3215 defined so that I can automate
the operation of MVS. That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?
Thanks. Paul.
C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>cvs diff
cvs diff: Diffing .
Index: sysgen01.jcl
===================================================================
RCS file: c:\cvsroot/mvsbuild/jcl/sysgen01.jcl,v
retrieving revision 1.3
diff -r1.3 sysgen01.jcl
60a61,70

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CONSOLE C
SECONS=011, C
ALTCONS=012, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*
CONSOLE C
SECONS=012, C
ALTCONS=011, C
ROUTCDE=ALL
*

71a82,89

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
CON011 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=011
*
CON012 IODEVICE C
UNIT=3215, C
ADDRESS=012
*

C:\devel\mvsbuild\jcl>

[Ivan Warren [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by Joe Monk ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
Also, comm3705.c indicates that it provides LU1 support. This would
indicate that the VTAM in MVS3.8J does line mode terminals.
Joe

It's not necesserally an indication of anything (hercules supports QDIO
Qeth, and that's certainly not supported by MVS 3.8j !)

I'm not sure MVS 3.8j VTAM even supports NCP FEPs (or even any multiple
subareas/Cross SSCP communications)

But I could be wrong (I know very little of anything OS/MVS related)

--Ivan

[Joe Monk [e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Ivan,

The VTAM in MVS 3.8J has ISTINC32 which is the loader module for the 3705.

Joe

Post by Joe Monk ***@gmail.com [H390-MVS]
Also, comm3705.c indicates that it provides LU1 support. This would
indicate that the VTAM in MVS3.8J does line mode terminals.
Joe
It's not necesserally an indication of anything (hercules supports QDIO
Qeth, and that's certainly not supported by MVS 3.8j !)
I'm not sure MVS 3.8j VTAM even supports NCP FEPs (or even any multiple
subareas/Cross SSCP communications)
But I could be wrong (I know very little of anything OS/MVS related)
--Ivan

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

Post by Ivan Warren ***@vmfacility.fr [H390-MVS]
I'm not sure MVS 3.8j VTAM even supports NCP FEPs (or even
any multiple subareas/Cross SSCP communications)

MVS 3.8 VTAM *does* support 3705's running NCP. The level of SNA support provided in 3.8j is quite minimal, but does qualify as "SNA". The VTAM in 3.8J does have support for SNA subareas albeit at a primitive level. Multi-subarea networks can be created and defined to VTAM; however, there is no cross-SSCP communications. The subarea types that VTAM understands are 1) itself 2) NCPs, and 3) switched major nodes.

Briefly, VTAM in 3.8J supports LU0, LU1, and LU2, but not LU6. It supports PU1 and PU2 but not PU2.1. In terms of SNA PIUs, FID1 and FID2 are supported, but not FID4. Both local and remote NCPs are understood and supported by 3.8j VTAM.

That means that VTAM natively supports 3767 (think TSO line mode) as well as 327x (TSO full screen mode)...

Max

p.s. looks like about a 12 hour latency between my last writing and when it posted. Way to go, Y!

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

All snipped.

I'm still out of town, but:

Use TSSO/SSSO for line-mode TSO.
Much simpler than TCAM and NCP/EP/PEP, but
each command is separate.

For console addresses, use what everyone else is using:
009 line-mode 3215-c
010 CRT
011 CRT
01F line-mode 3215-c
Do not use 3215 or 1052 in Hercules without the -c or
expect MVS to hang.

For JOB execution order:
Don't specify LINES on some JOBs but not or
specified different on the other JOBs.
or
Fix your JES2PARM to be what IBM recommends.
All &XPRI should specify the same number/priority.
That gives the same priority for any LINES coded.
Their sample used the number 7

[[e-mail] [H390-MVS]]

(Expand previous message, if my reply is hidden).

Post by ***@yahoo.com.au [H390-MVS]
That just leaves defining
line mode terminals for TSO. Anyone know how
to do that?
Thanks. Paul.

Will this help?

http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/ http://www.lightlink.com/mhp/2703/

ScottC